Ground Rules Part 2

I completely agree with XY that we should be able to call periods of abstinence. I'm not sure we should even have to give a good reason. Unless "I just feel a bit weird about it at the moment" counts as a good reason. Obviously we'll have to see how it goes - we can't be saying all the time "no, not now... not now... not now." That's never going to work. But I don't think that'll happen. I know that for me I'll try to resist saying anything until I really feel I have to.

I know I'd feel happier if XY told girls he was in a relationship from the outset, and made it clear that I'm happy for him to put his penis inside them but he will not be watching "films" or eating pizza with them. But I think it's okay to take every situation as it comes really, and just use our judgment to decide what's best to do.

It's quite likely that I won't be telling anyone I'm in a relationship. Partly for the reason XY mentioned - I don't want any boy to feel like he has something over XY, even if they're never going to meet or know anything more about each other. I'm not sure about girls. I think I still wouldn't tell them. When I go out and drunkenly kiss strangers, I don't feel I owe them anything. I never felt guilty about not going any further than kissing, or about refusing to give my phone number, or about refusing to see them again. I think a drunken kiss is a drunken kiss and if you assume you're going to get anything more than that you're a bit of a fool. You can hope for more, but I don't owe you anything.

Obviously if more than kissing happens it gets slightly more crap, but even then... If I do stuff with anyone I don't presume it's going to lead to anything else. So I don't see why anyone else should presume anything either. It's a bit naïve, if you ask me. Or am I just horrible? I think it's a case of seeing how it goes anyway. Assuming I do actually get to do things with people, I'll just have to find out from experience the best way to handle it. But obviously if XY has any preference I'll take that into consideration.

I have no arguments about ensuring we don't make each other look stupid.

And if we do mention that we're in a relationship and the person in question says anything negative about us, I think that should really be the time to call it off. Like, if I did mention that I had a boyfriend to someone and they came out with something like, "He can't really love you if he lets you do this," or something along those lines... I think that would be a good time to leave. That's not a rule as such though, and if I were drunk I might let them get away with it, knowing I wasn't going to have any contact with them again anyway. If someone seriously tried to convince me that I shouldn't be with XY I definitely wouldn't take it any further. But since I'm not planning to tell anyone probably, maybe that's not so much an issue for me.

Protection always, obviously, for pretty much everything. Kissing with dental dams please :) One of the things I am worried about with this is that it'll make both of us less confident that we're not going to pass anything dodgy on to each other. It's one of the few nice things about not being very experienced. Of course I know we'll both be careful. It's just that nothing's 100% guaranteed. Which is pretty crap.

I'm actually really worried too about XY accidentally getting someone pregnant. In my case I'm doubly protected because I'm on the pill and of course I'd always insist on condoms. But XY can't make sure someone's on the pill. The idea of him ending up having to cope with a baby with someone else... God, that would get so messy. But those are just the risks you have to take with sex I suppose.

I'm sure I'll think of things, but I can't think of everything now. Maybe we need to just update whenever we think of something. And it's something we'll learn from experience really, we'll never think of all the problems that could occur before we're even doing anything.

We need to discuss if there's anyone absolutely off-limits. Each other's friends and family obviously, but I don't think that really applies since we don't mix in the same circles. I'm not sure about people we're friends with. I think probably best to avoid that, at least to begin with, until we discover how okay with this we really are. I think that has a lot more potential for jealousy and messiness than one-off encounters with strangers or almost-strangers. But I don't know where we draw the line between friend and almost-stranger. It's simpler for me because I go places where I see people once then never see them again. I know it's not so clear-cut for XY.

And we need to discuss how and when to tell each other. I'm not sure about that yet. I think the idea of not telling each other immediately, so that we've already seen each other and been normal with each other in between, is a good one. But then if we know the other person's been out we're obviously going to wonder...

Ground Rules?

I think XX is worrying unnecessarily about some things. First of all, I'm not sure why she thinks I'm more likely to get sex than her. While it's probably true that my sexual desires are less affected by my general opinions of a person I'm not at ease with sleeping with just any girl. Sex is still a massive deal for me. I have a long list of insecurities I'd need to get over too. 

XX thinks she is unattractive and is sorely mistaken. I obviously find her attractive, I'm attracted to her! But I think we're talking about attractiveness on some sort of global level. She can quite easily go out and have boys openly interested in her. I quite often don't get so much as a second glance from girls. I don't like thinking about how attractive or unattractive I am but I don't think I'm hideous, I just think I'm not going to get girls trying to get into my trousers.

XX's fears that I might get more action than her are not needed. Although I have the same fears. I can't stand the thought of XX going around fucking various men while I spend my time jacking off to porn or something.

Open relationships are dangerous. What we're considering isn't to be taken lightly. I think we should set rules here perhaps... we can toss ideas back and forth and then draw up a constitution.

 I think we should be able to call periods of absitence from sex outside the relationship. If one of us feels particuarly vulnerable for whatever reason, I think we should retain the right to forbid the other person from doing anything. Good reasons should be given.

As discussed at one point in time I feel that I should be made to explain to girls I meet that I have a relationship and that anything we get up to is purely recreational whereas XX will hide this fact from potential partners due to the fact that most of us men are utter wankers that revel in the idea of sleeping with another man's woman and bragging about it.

We should also take any lengths necessary to ensure that neither party is made to look like a fool by anything we do. At no point should either of us appear to be pathetic.

That's all I can think of for now...

Not So Much Rambling

I've just realised there's a much more concise way to express my feelings on all this, and make it clear that I'm not just accepting that XY wants sex with other people and just going along with that to keep him happy.

Say that someone were to offer to grant me a wish now, and say that either they could stop XY wanting sex with other people, or they could guarantee me good sex with other people. I would definitely, without a shadow of a doubt, ask for the second one.

I hope that clarifies things.

I'm not bothered by the fact that XY wants other people. I think that's the way it should be, and if people in a relationship don't want other people to some extent then either they're lying to themselves or it's probably a pretty unhealthy relationship. My ideal relationship would involve sexual experiences with other people. What I'm bothered by is how I'll feel when he's doing all the things I wish I could do. That's the problem I want to solve.

Ramblings

If I knew I could get whoever I wanted, whenever I wanted, and that I could orgasm (or at least have a very nice time) from every sexual experience I had, that's what would get rid of any doubts I have about an open relationship.

If I could be off having my own experiences while XY was having his, I'm actually confident that I'd be totally fine with it. I'd be very happy about it, in fact. I never thought I'd find someone who'd understand that I don't think even "serious" relationships should have to be monogamous. If we choose sex as the one activity we can't do with other people, then it kind of implies that sex is what our relationship is about. Which it's very much not. Sex is just a lovely bonus.

So this isn't really about me being jealous of the other people he'd do things with. It's that I'll be jealous of him. Because he'll be getting to do things while I, despite being "allowed" to, won't. There are so many reasons why this won't be as rewarding for me...

1. I've got so much work to do I've got no time for socialising of any kind, let alone the sexual kind.

2. Even if I do go out, my shyness and lack of attractiveness mean it's unlikely I'll get anywhere with anyone anyway.

3. If I do get anywhere with anyone, it's going to be someone male (because getting girls will be harder for pretty obvious reasons) who I don't find at all attractive. Whereas XY finds quite a lot of girls fairly attractive and so would probably feel some level of attraction to whoever he was with, I rarely find people attractive and hardly ever with boys. And if I do find someone attractive then they're the last person I'm going to end up speaking to because I'd be far too intimidated. So it will be someone I don't like.

4. If I get to the point of doing anything more than kissing, the chances are it'll be bad. I certainly won't get to come. But it probably won't even be good. Because it'll be with some inept drunk who either won't be able to do anything at all, or will do it in a way that hurts me, or it'll just feel awkward and I'll be bored, or it might be good but over really quickly. I'm afraid that's just the reality of sex for me - a lot of factors contribute to how sex feels for me (and a major one will be how comfortable I feel with the person), and I'm not experienced or dominant enough to ensure things happen in a good way. Again that's different for XY because presumably even bad sex will feel pretty good. And will still end in orgasm.

If I do do something and it feels bad or awkward, I won't just not feel good, it'll actually depress me. Because then it's like I've given something to someone and got nothing in return. I'm not sure if "used" is the word, but... something similar. If I have sex with someone I like and it turns out not to be amazing for whatever reason, I don't feel robbed of anything. It's just one of those things - it'll be better next time, and I like them so I'm happy to have done it anyway. A one night stand with someone I don't know won't work like that. I'll feel like I've had something taken away from me. I don't mean I'd automatically feel like that about any casual sex - good casual sex I would love to have and wouldn't feel bad about at all. But if the other person gets more out of it than I do, and the chances are they will, then I will feel bad.

So that's what it is really. I don't think I'll get to do anything, even if I do it'll be with someone I don't find attractive at all, and then there's a high probability of it being crap. And leading to me not just not feeling good, but actually feeling bad.

But those are just my reservations. I really want to have lots of different experiences. I just think good experiences will be more elusive for me than they'll be for XY. And that will make me bitter. Not the fact that he's doing things without me, but the fact that I don't get to do the same things.

I think the main solution with this is for me to focus on girls. I could be wrong of course, but I think the potential for bad sex would be lower with a girl (and if it were bad for me then it'd probably be bad for her too so at least it'd be more balanced). And I find a lot more girls attractive so I'm more likely to find someone I do feel something towards, even if it's not much.

So then the issues are that girls who like girls are much harder to find, girls are much less likely to make the first move (and I'm certainly not going to be making it) and even if they do they might be less up for taking things further straight away. Certainly in my experience no girls I've kissed in clubs have ever offered me anything more. Oh, except a girl who insisted on walking me home then tried to force her way into my flat, but she was absolutely terrifying. See, this is what I mean. I can only get the crap people to want me.

I'm babbling. I really, really want to do sex with girls. Lots of girls. I want to a lot. And I want to do sex with boys except that the above reservations make me doubtful about casual encounters. I don't want to go through life only having had sex with one boy, of course I don't. And I think if I have sex with other people, including boys (and if XY has sex with other people too), it'll actually lead to us having better sex together. I think it's an all-round good thing.

My issue with this isn't that I don't want to do it. It's that I don't think I will do it, at least not in a way that satisfies me. Now that XY has set the standard so high, I just don't think passionless drunken fumbles will cut it anymore.

Escape from Mundania: A response

Wow! XX's post has really troubled me. First of all... mundane? I've never considered what we have to be mundane in the slightest. I think maybe that XX has forgotten that when I took her virginity I also felt as if she'd taken mine. What happened before our relationship doesn't really compare. A casual yet creepy encouter that I'd not like to repeat.

I don't think there's a sense of running out of time. Age has nothing to do with it. I've had sharp reminders of the fragile nature of human life and don't think that anyone should plan things in accordance with ageing.

XX says she's had years of drunken passionless fumbles with people she's felt no attraction to. That's exactly what I haven't had! This is perhaps the actual source of me feeling like there's something I need to get out of my system. I've experience love before. In fact, love and sex aren't remotely linked in my mind because it's only recently that I've had sex with someone I love. My years spent single were spent with little or no female interest whatsoever. 

I had a brief look at the map and dismissed it as ridiculous. For a start, I don't and never want to feel like I'm working through a list and ticking boxes. A sexual act should only be performed if you want it, not because you've heard about someone else doing it and you don't want to miss out. I never want to shit on a snake while simultaneously pissing at a religious relic or whatever is on that thing.

Our goal of inviting another girl to join in having sex with us appeals to both of us as XX is bi-sexual although XX also feels that her having sex with another female doesn't quite balance out me having sex with someone else. She is right to say that It's a lot easier to cope with your partner having sex with someone of the same gender.

I love XX so much that I'd hate for her to put herself through something like an open relationship for my benefit alone. I'd be happier staying faithful and not even glancing at another girl if it meant that XX felt secure and loved. For both of us to enjoy sex outside our relationship, I think we both need to have the exact same feelings as each other.

Escape from Mundania

A couple of times recently I've nearly mentioned The Map of Human Sexuality to XY but then changed my mind, because I've worried that it'll just remind him of (and make him sad about) our current residence in the Land of Mundania.

Not that that doesn't worry me too, but I think it bothers me less than him for the moment. I'm not sure why, since I'm older so I should really be the one panicking about running out of time for wild exciting sexy times. Of course it bothers me sometimes, but for the time being, I'm not too worried. After all, I lost my virginity less than a year ago, after over ten years of waiting, and it's only fairly recently I've reached the point where I'm totally comfortable with it.

The fact that I've even got this far amazes me, because I'd reached the point where I really didn't think I would. I'd pretty much given up on sex, and on the idea of doing anything sexual at all with someone I liked. I was settling for drunken passionless fumbles with people I felt no attraction at all to, and I thought that was all I could ever hope for. So the fact that I now regularly have sex with a lovely yummy boy I can't keep my hands off is such a huge step up from where I was, for now that's enough to keep me satisfied.

But getting back to the map... It's a bit intimidating. Even in my wildest dreams I can't see me venturing out very far, and for such an open-minded person that makes me feel a bit disappointed with myself. But then being open-minded just means I don't judge other people for doing things, and if someone really wanted to do something with me I'd be open to trying it. Being open-minded doesn't necessarily involve the desire to do everything it's possible to do.

There should be a version where you can just delete anything you absolutely know you never want to do. At least then it would look a bit more achievable. Not that there are many things I know for certain I will never want to do. "Hardly ever say never," as a great man once told me. But I think we can safely sink the Island of Non Consent, for a start. And while I have to admit I don't know what all those things mean, most of the stuff beyond the Impassable Reaches would obviously have to go too. Though, not all of them are absolutely out of the question... Should vomit really be categorised with bestiality and necrophilia? It's not nice, no, but surely it's on a completely different scale of “not nice”. And golden showers certainly shouldn't be up there!

Of course, that's another problem with the map – it's all pretty subjective. Same sex experiences, for instance, could be the very last thing some people would do. Whereas it'd be pretty mundane for others. But I suppose the map is just supposed to give some sort of average representation. What would be really good, would be a map where you can move things around in an order that makes sense for you. I quite like the idea of seeing how much further I've ventured out every now and then. Assuming I ever do, of course.

VIAGRA or PLACEBO?

"In clinical studies, 86% of men with your symptoms improved their erections with VIAGRA (versus 32% of men taking a sugar pill)."

Almost a one in three chance that a placebo will get you as hard as viagra itself? If it wouldn't negate the effects, it'd be tempting to ask your doctor for a sugar pill instead to see if that did the trick! Sex is too important to be left to chance though right?

Porn that makes me lol pt I

It's a sad sad day when she gives up at least pretending to look like she's into it...